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Ray Boltz has come out of the closet.

17 Sep

I remember listening to Ray Boltz when my wife and I first discovered Christian music many years ago. He sang some pretty moving songs like “Watch the Lamb” and “I Pledge Allegiance To the Lamb”. Thinking back I don’t recall how theologically sound the lyrics were, but he still had quite an impact on the Christian music world. Now he has “come out” as the homosexual society puts it, and says he is happy again. Oh how the heart can deceive us into believing what makes us happy is right. There is an informative and interesting article about Ray Boltz at The Washington Blade that sheds some light on this story.

How should we think about this? There is a simple illustration I can think of. I am unhappy about having to obey the traffic laws, especially when I am in a hurry to go somewhere. It would make me very happy if I could ignore those laws in those times that are not convenient to me. But the traffic laws have a reason, and that reason is to keep us all safe while we are driving. God has given us laws as well. Whether we like them or not they do exist. Unlike state laws, these laws from God are not negotiable or subject to legislative changes. I believe that some of His laws exist to keep us safe as well. Regardless of the reason they exist, God, the Creator, demands that we obey them. These laws have been revealed to us in his scriptures. As believers in Christ we can choose to obey them or not. But please don’t fool yourself into believing there will not be consequences or an accounting for the foolish decision to ignore them.

As for Ray Boltz, we should be praying for him and his family. We should also be praying for those who will stand up and not be passive while this kind of behavior continues to filter into the local churches. We should also pray that we would make this stand in love and for the ultimate repentance and restoration of those like Ray Boltz. This brings up a thought for consideration. Can you be a Christian and also be gay? Please consider reading 1 Corintians 6. In verses 9 and 10 of that chapter you will find:

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

The apostle Paul goes on to write to the Corinthians in verse 11:

11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

The scriptures make it clear that believers of Christ have been washed, sanctified, and justified in the name of Christ. We should no longer practice those former things. That is great news. Only by trusting in the Christ, will you have the power to fight against those former sinful things. Amen?

ht: Christian Theology Blog

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32 responses to “Ray Boltz has come out of the closet.

  1. Suzanne Kunkle

    September 17, 2008 at 10:07 am

    Amen to all that you stated !!!!

     
  2. J.Random

    September 17, 2008 at 11:49 am

    The way you compare homosexuality to obeying traffic laws betrays a deep ignorance about how this actually affects people. You can obey the traffic laws and still get where you’re going. You can’t live in self-hate and still have a fulfilling life.

    Too few Christians realize that their understanding of the Bible is as flawed and imperfect as they are.

     
  3. Shane

    September 17, 2008 at 12:49 pm

    Can you be a Christian and be gay? That’s something only God knows. From the passage you posted, then we are all condemned and will not enter the kingdom of Heaven. It is only by His Grace and Mercy that we are not utterly condemned to begin with.

    So, I will leave that decision to Christ, and I will love this brother unconditionally without judging him. I believe people will see their sin more when they see true Love. And if they see TRUE love, they see God, because God is love.

    Once they have a true encounter with that love (God), God’s light will shine through their darkness, and He will convict of sin. Our job is to love.

    P.S. Keep the Tuesday reviews comin! I always enjoy those. 🙂

    God bless!

     
  4. barrydean

    September 17, 2008 at 1:07 pm

    Thanks for your comment Suzanne.

    J. Random,

    As if that’s your real name. 🙂 I am not exactly sure what you are stating. What do you mean by self-hate? Fulfilling life? I agree that the sin of homosexuality affects people much more than the sin of disobeying the traffic laws. If you are saying that we can’t interpret scripture like the one mentioned above, then how plain do you need it to be? It clearly says that those who practice those things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

     
  5. Shane

    September 17, 2008 at 1:43 pm

    Barry,

    How do we interpret the Scipture that states that if we even look at another person with lust, we are committing adultery already in our hearts? Doesn’t the Bible state that adulterers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Or the Scriptures that state that if we hate our brother, the love of God is not in us? Or that pride leads to destruction?

    Sin in general is evil. WE, in general, are evil. But it is by Grace we were saved, through faith. It is a gift from God, that no man can boast.

    I am by no means criticising your post. I just am posing some questions maybe to ponder.

    The Word of God declares that Love covers a multitude of sins. Sin is sin to God. He hates sin, but He loves us with all of His heart. Do you believe that someone who smokes cigarrettes will not enter the kingdom of Heaven and is not a Christian because that person is defiling his/her body? Who knows. Only God knows the answer to that. That’s all I’m saying.

    J Random,

    Please do not be so quick to judge. Everyone interprets Scripture how they see it. It does not mean their views are flawed, it just means that is how they interpret its meaning at the time. Imperfect? We are all imperfect. Just because someone disagrees with a certain aspect of Scripture does not mean they have a flawed understanding of it. Who can compare and fully understand the Lord? Not one. I can see where Barry’s coming from with the analogy of the traffic laws. If you disobey the laws, it could lead to your death. That’s a possibility. So I can see where he’s coming from.

    Please let’s not be critical. We can agree to disagree, but let’s not criticize as if we have all the answers, because we don’t.

    Good thought provoking post, Barry.

     
  6. barrydean

    September 17, 2008 at 2:55 pm

    1 Corinthians 5

    1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father’s wife. 2 And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you. 3 For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. 4 When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5 you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord. 6 Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? 7 Cleanse out the old leaven that you may be a new lump, as you really are unleavened. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. 8 Let us therefore celebrate the festival, not with the old leaven, the leaven of malice and evil, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
    9 I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people 10 not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler not even to eat with such a one. 12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? 13 God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you.

     
  7. Shane

    September 17, 2008 at 3:19 pm

    2 Corinthians 2
    1 So I decided that I would not bring you grief with another painful visit. 2 For if I cause you grief, who will make me glad? Certainly not someone I have grieved. 3 That is why I wrote to you as I did, so that when I do come, I won’t be grieved by the very ones who ought to give me the greatest joy. Surely you all know that my joy comes from your being joyful. 4 I wrote that letter in great anguish, with a troubled heart and many tears. I didn’t want to grieve you, but I wanted to let you know how much love I have for you.

    Forgiveness for the Sinner
    5 I am not overstating it when I say that the man who caused all the trouble hurt all of you more than he hurt me. 6 Most of you opposed him, and that was punishment enough. 7 Now, however, it is time to forgive and comfort him. Otherwise he may be overcome by discouragement. 8 So I urge you now to reaffirm your love for him.
    9 I wrote to you as I did to test you and see if you would fully comply with my instructions. 10 When you forgive this man, I forgive him, too. And when I forgive whatever needs to be forgiven, I do so with Christ’s authority for your benefit, 11 so that Satan will not outsmart us. For we are familiar with his evil schemes.

     
  8. Nathan W. Bingham

    September 17, 2008 at 5:07 pm

    Barry:

    Thanks for your posting.

    Some of the commenters are correct, we cannot know the heart of a person – but we are called to judge those who claim to be our brothers and sisters (1 Cor. 5:12). Ray’s actions of openly living a homosexual life give great evidence according to Scripture that he was never a child of God. However, if he is then it is the duty of the Church to practice Church Discipline, calling him to repentance. If he truly has been born of God’s Spirit, then he will repent and be restored…he will not remain in his sin of homosexuality.

    The Scripture that Shane posted ‘in response’ are taken out of context. Corinth was boasting in their acceptance of immorality (one could say this is the same response by some in the ‘Christian Community’ regarding Ray) and so Paul severely called them to remove this unrepentant immoral person. Corinth then went to the other extreme, they did not allow this person to be restored once he had repented. If this person had not repented of his immorality, Paul would not have written his words in 2 Corinthians 2.

    What do we do with Ray Boltz? We heed Paul’s words as Barry has suggested, marking him out for discipline and calling him to repent. If he ever was one of God’s, he will repent. If not, he is evidencing his unregenerate state and we should thank God that it has been exposed and made public, as opposed to him secretly being amongst us.

    We must also remember that this is not a one of act of sin, but a lifestyle of unrepentant sin. A believer of God cannot continue in sin (1 John 3:9) for the Spirit of God within him will convict and cause repentance. At present, Ray Boltz testifies to his own happiness.

     
  9. barrydean

    September 17, 2008 at 6:09 pm

    Nat,

    Thank you. I couldn’t have said it better. We are called as followers of Christ to forgive of course. What we are talking about here is in fact a person who professes to be a believer living in sin. Christ tells us in Matthew 18 how to deal with those who are in the church and living in sin. If there is no repentance of this sin then our purpose in this situation is to restore him. Like the scripture in 1 John 1:9. John is writing to believers here and he writes:

    If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

    Restoration and forgiveness is offered where there is confession and repentance of the sin.

     
  10. RJ Fenley

    September 17, 2008 at 6:55 pm

    “I agree that the sin of homosexuality affects people much more than the sin of disobeying the traffic laws.”

    I thought all sins are equal?

    That’s what I thought.

    See, the problem with the Christian Right constantly taking to task certain types of sins is that it says more about the condemner than the condemned. Otherwise, you wouldn’t focus on certain sins, particularly ones that are practiced so rarely such as homosexuality. If you really just cared about sinning or even certain sins committed in abundance — rather than particular sins not committed in abundance such as homosexuality, the Christian Right would have dismantled the current Administration, which is rife with sin. Right? Get your priorities straight, Brother Barry.

    Yours truly,

    The grandson of a preacher

     
  11. Jeremy

    September 17, 2008 at 8:19 pm

    I believe what he meant by the sin of the homosexual is what was stated earlier. You can obey all the traffic laws and still get where you are going. Those under the sin of homosexuality are bound to it and w/o it, they cannot achieve what they see fit. Thus, they cannot live their life w/o the sin while another can live their life w/o the sin of traffic laws and not miss anything, really. Those who are always against the Christian Right read way to deep into many things, it’s typical.

    Yes, all sins are equal in God’s eyes. Many sins are more difficult to deal with for us than others. i.e. addiction to crack cocaine vs. stealing a candy bar. One does not become addicted to stealing a candy bar as one does to crack cocaine (at least not yet, soon it will be a disease I am sure).

     
  12. pashley1916

    September 17, 2008 at 8:31 pm

    I love when these people see this incident as Boltz finally realizing his true happiness, and embracing it…blah, blah.

    They never see it has a man that has given into illicit temptations. Oh no, that can’t be it.

    Kinda like saying an alcoholic should go back on the bottle so he’s happy.

    http://pashley1916.wordpress.com/

     
  13. saltedwithfire

    September 17, 2008 at 9:01 pm

    As one that has come out of homosexuality, it grieves my heart that this has happened. There is no doubt that homosexuality and the Christian faith are mutually exclusive–just as one that submits himself to a lifestyle of adultery is leaving God. If he belongs to the Lord, then he will be miserable doing this, but if his deepest desire is to be sexually intimate with other males, then he doesn’t belong to God.

     
  14. saltedwithfire

    September 17, 2008 at 9:09 pm

    In March, the director of the Human Genome Project, Dr. Francis Collins, said this, ‘Homosexuality is not hardwired. There is no gay gene. We mapped the human genome. We now know there is no genetic cause for homosexuality.’”

     
  15. barrydean

    September 17, 2008 at 9:11 pm

    Salted,

    Thanks for the comment. You are so right on. I appreciate your courage. Although you would probably be the first to give all that to the power of Christ in you.

    Yep. You weren’t born that way, and God didn’t make you that way. Although he has allowed you to go through that season for a reason. 🙂 Thanks for sharing brother.

     
  16. Jacob Allee

    September 17, 2008 at 9:37 pm

    I like to have sex with 6 year old children and I am a Christian. Oh no, don’t you judge me, that would be unloving, and I say I am a Christian so who are you to tell me that I am not.

    Is there not a real problem with that claim? Of course there is.

    Shane,

    Yes by the Corinthian standard we all are worthy of hell because we have all sinned and hated = murdered our brother and so on and so forth. But there is a major problem that you are missing. The text indicates that these are present tense, ongoing lifestyles. Those who have repented and trusted Christ for salvation no longer walk in this way. No this doesn’t make us perfect and yes we still sin, but there is a major difference between embracing a sinful lifestyle and struggling towards sanctification and living a life of repentance. Scripture is clear as crystal that those who are living such lifestyles will not inherit the kingdom of God. It’s a big difference between a Christian who falls into sin and repents and keeps pursuing righteousness and a person who blatantly accepts sin into their life as a way of life.

    J. Random, perhaps you could tell us what the Scripture Barry quoted actually means, since you claim He misinterpreted it. Don’t just say He is wrong, provide from the text what the Apostle Paul was actually saying.

    Scripture makes very clear that we don’t judge unbelievers but it is those in the church who we are to judge (1 Corinthians 5:12). And Nathan is right that the issue brought up about not forgiving was out of context. If Boltz said tomorrow, “You know what I am in sin, and I repent, help me to get right with God” then the Christian community should rush to him with open arms and forgiveness and restore him to fellowship. But as long as he walks in open sin, and refuses the loving charge to repent, then He should be treated as an unbeliever, still welcome to hear the word proclaimed, but all fellowship outside of the church should be cut off, no one should even eat with him (1 Corinthians 5:11).

    And by the way, let’s kill the “all sins are equal” thing. This is only true insofar as the smallest of sins is enough to earn eternity in Hell apart from God just as much as the big ones, but if all sins are counted exactly the same then why does Jesus say:

    10 But whenever you enter a town and they do not receive you, go into its streets and say, 11 ‘Even the dust of your town that clings to our feet we wipe off against you. Nevertheless know this, that the kingdom of God has come near.’ 12 I tell you, it will be more bearable on that day for Sodom than for that town. (Luke 10:10-12).

    If it will be better for some of the lost then other on the day of judgment, I think that indicates something.

    And Preacher’s grandson, get off your don’t judge pedastal because you yourself are judging. I actually agree that evangelical’s talk to much about the homosexual issue, but then does that make it not sinful because it draws so much attention. No, it is still a real problem because it is inconsistent with the Christian lifestyle, just like heterosexual sex outside of marriage is inconsistent with the Christian lifestyle. The reason this is such an issue however is because homosexuals are demanding special rights and trying to redefine marriage. If the want the Christian community to ignore them then they should stop trying to force their beliefs on the culture that overwhelmingly supports the traditional understanding of marriage. They are welcome int his country to speak their mind, and I don’t think we ought to round up homosexuals and ship them to Tibet or anything, but this is a democracy supposedly but do the homosexuals want this marriage issue to come to a public vote? No. Because they would lose.

     
  17. normbetland

    September 17, 2008 at 10:44 pm

    RJ

    Homosexuality may be practiced rarely, though I doubt that it is all that rare, but homosexuals are constantly demanding for their sin to be not considered sin any longer. They put themselves out there and talk all the time, they have parades for themselves, etc, etc.

    What are we supposed to do? Ignore it?

     
  18. letthewhitedovesing

    September 17, 2008 at 11:54 pm

    Homosexuality is sexual disorientation.

     
  19. Manca

    September 18, 2008 at 7:23 am

    It’s issues like these that have kept me from any religion. It irritates me how people think that some outdated words written on paper thousands of years ago should rule peoples lives today.

    I think you are being too harsh on the poor man. Purely hypothetically speaking, imagine what your life would be like if your religion/society/whatever demanded that you only enter relationships with men. And if you would happen to say “no, I prefer women!” people would judge you and condemn you and tell you you will be damned for all eternity for not following the rules of conduct. This is the position he is in. How would you feel about yourself if you had to spend all your life pretending that you’re something you are not? This is not something he can change, he is as he is. The only choice he has is to deny it, pretend he’s someone he’s not or accept it and live his life as he knows he should and be happy. What do you propose he does?

    I have always found it interesting how “Christians” (I use the term loosely because many different groups of people use the same name, some are better than others) always preach of love and understanding and all things great, but you are so relentlessly unforgiving when it comes to such things. You will quickly condemn a man to hell (or whatever) because he will not regret having a good, happy life? I know homosexuals who have been in commited relationships for many years and are far better people than some “christians” I know. It’s ridiculous. Just because they were born different and because they don’t regret it, they’re no good? Simply ridiculous.

     
  20. Shane

    September 18, 2008 at 8:54 am

    This grieves me. It really does. Manca, this is not how God is, from what you’re describing. He loves us all more than anything in all of creation.

    I love Boltz with the love of Christ. By God’s grace, I will love anyone, because we are all God’s children.

    Condemning is not my job.

    Loving is.

    It’s a choice. Are we really being Christian exposing people? No. Boltz exposed HIMSELF. But, we think we are better and need to expound on his “sin”? When are we going to truly walk in Christ’s ways?

     
  21. barrydean

    September 18, 2008 at 10:12 am

    Manca,

    Actually this is how God is. The only way we know God is through His revealed word. We do not get to know God by how we feel He is. He is indeed a loving God but He is also a just God. His word (the Bible) tells us that He loves. It also tells us that he cannot be joined with unrighteousness. So He sent His son Jesus Christ to die in our behalf to set things right between Himself and man. The only thing He asks is that we trust and believe in His son and follow Him. For when we trust in Christ for what He did on the cross then we also take on his righteousness. If you are not a follower of Christ then you have no real understanding of what we are truly talking about here. We are talking about someone who claims the name of Christ but is living contrary to what He teaches. God says homosexuality is an abomination to Him. We love Ray Boltz and yet we are praying for his repentance and restoration. I encourge you to read the bible and get an understanding of who God is. Not how we, his creation, would like to see Him.

    Shane,

    It seems to me that you are saying that if we hold Boltz to this standard then we are unloving. I say the opposite it is true. We seek his repentance because we love him and wish to see him restored.

     
  22. Jacob Allee

    September 18, 2008 at 10:28 am

    Give me a break Shane. I do not condemn Boltz, nor does Barry, God does in His word, just as much as He condemns the theif the murderer and the heterosexual that has sex outside of marriage. No Christian should be thinking “Well he’s gay now, let’s all hate him!” C’mon people! That’s not what Barry said, that’s not what Nathan said and that’s not what I said…and guess what, that’s not what the Bible says! There is a major difference between saying something is wrong and sinful and warning a person that they are in danger because of their lifestyle not being consistent with what the Bible says a person who is born again should be living, vs., judging people and “damning them”.

    Your right shane, God will judge, but the thing is, He has already said that he is against sin in every shape and form, and your right that it is our job to love sinners, but let me ask you this:

    A man who is standing on the train tracks, completely unaware of the speeding train coming at him, what is the loving thing to do? You tell him to move, push him out of the way if you must! Is it judging him to warn him that it is dangerous to stand on the train tracks? No, it is loving him.

    God has spoken clearly about what He thinks about sin and how we are to warn people of the consequences of their sin so that….wait for it… they may repent and believe the gospel and be saved. Barry is not judging Ray Boltz, nor am I, God is. And we are simply saying what God has already pronounced and we would do the same for the “Christian” that decided to divorce their husband and live with another man,etc…

    Manca,

    You may not think that the Bible is the word of God, and you may think that all religions are oppresive or something, but the fact of the matter is Christianity is true. We have historical evidence that backs up the claims of Christianity, no other religion can boast that. If you were to actually investigate the claims of Christianity honestly you would be amazed to see that it is for real. And what you would find is that that old book actually has a claim on your life because it is not just an old book, it is the living word of God and it is true and it holds the message of eternal life.

     
  23. Shane

    September 18, 2008 at 12:40 pm

    How can Manca or anyone else believe the Word of God is true when someone openly exposes someone on this public venue in this way. Why do you think Boltz was hiding for so long? Because he knew this type of thing would happen. God didn’t create ignorant people. People in general know right from wrong. It is not our place to be talking about or exposing Boltz or anyone else for that matter.

    Yes, God hates sin. And He and He alone is the only one that can lovingly, expose it. Barry, with all due respect, this is not how God is. Why would the same author which you quoted previously say that Love covers a multitude of sins? Jesus Christ came to die for our sin. Does that mean we still do not sin? Of course not. ALL of us do on a daily basis.

    Jacob,

    Let me ask you something. Is there some sin you are struggling with right now? Or maybe something that other people feel is wrong but possibly you do not? Would you want fellow “Christians” finding out about it and telling you how wrong you are and that you need to repent or would you rather have someone just love you. Regardless of what you’re going through, just someone that is there and loves you? Be honest, because the time may come where it could happen, and you may get the same thing that you have demonstrated to someone else. Remember, treat others as you would like to be treated. Love others like you would love yourself.

    I don’t think you’d want to be treated this way, and this is NOT how God treats His children. It is not.

    Thank you for listening.

     
  24. David

    September 18, 2008 at 1:25 pm

    Ok, I used to listen to ray boltz, dc talk, steven curtus chapman and other christian artists…. I KNOW FOR A FACT that each one of them have sinned in the eyes of God. How can we say we still can’t listen to Ray Boltz anymore. Are you saying that you are perfect? God specifically talks about this when he says in Matthew 7:3-5, “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.” If anything, we need to listen to his music more because God is the only one that is going to be glorified in this circumstance!

     
  25. Jenny

    September 18, 2008 at 4:39 pm

    The work plainly states that homosexuality is a sin. I don’t think anyone was just “born this way”. It is a spirit that has attacked this man for years and caused him to have mental issues. When he was fighting the fleshly desires and working hard on living for the Lord, he was blessed and used. When he gave into this spirit the enemy no longer no longer had to battled him, he won. This once saved, gifted man is now lost in a world of sin. Hell is waiting on those who will turn their backs on God. We are not supposed to judge others, that is for God to do. Only pray for him. And for those of you who believe “once saved, always saved”. News flash: Lucifer was once an angel and I do believe the Bible says he and 1/3 of the angels were cast out of heaven. However, there is repentance and forgiveness and we should only pray for Ray Boltz and his former family not have a blog full of debates.

     
  26. Jacob Allee

    September 18, 2008 at 6:02 pm

    Jenny,

    Thanks for that news flash, as a former pentecostal, believe me, I know much about the view that a person can lose their salvation. However it was my study of the Scriptures that led me to understand that this view is faulty. Eph. 1:13-14, Rom. 8:30, etc., make very clear that the person who is truly saved will never be lost. Jesus promises to raise all who have come to him on the last day (John 6:44). Those whom he says to ”I never knew you” notice He says ”never”not ”used to.” It is clear that the basis for our salvation is God’s power to draw us to Himself and keep us in the faith.

    Shane,

    I’m not sure if you are reading my posts or not, it doesn’t seem like you are hearing what I am saying at all. It is out oflove that we should warn people like Ray to repent. Has anyone here made fun of him? No. We are not ”exposing” him, he exposed himself. It is the proper response of the Christian community to speak the truth in love and tell him that this is not ok. If he is saved then he needs to repent and get right with God, if he isn’t then he needs to repent and get right with God!

    You quote the famous ”log in the eye” passage, but do you realize that Jesus says that a person can still judge, just not hypocritically.

    Yes I am a sinner, I’ll be the first to admit that. But there is a difference between struggling as a sinner and pursuing righteousness vs. embracing a lifestyle of sin and rejecting the word of God.

    The scripture calls Christians God’s ambassadors here on earth. We are to proclaim His truth, ALL OF IT, His love and His forgiveness and His wrath and anger against sin (Rom. 1:18-on).

    You give me the impression that we should only talk about ewey gooey God of love and ignore the fact that God hates sin so much that He wiped out nations over it.

    Preach the whole counsel of God’s word!

     
  27. Jacob Allee

    September 18, 2008 at 6:07 pm

    I think I got David and Shane’s comments turned around before, but my response to the comments stay the same. And by the way, Shane, If I ever became a homosexual I would hope that you and those around me would Follow Matthew 18 and confront me and discipline me as Jesus said to do, even if it hurt my feelings. A persons eternal soul and where it is going is more important than hurt feelings.

     
  28. B. Freese

    September 18, 2008 at 7:55 pm

    TO ANYONE WHO WANTS TO HEAR MY OPINION:

    In the Beginning God created. . . . Ok, almost all of us agree on that. I know I didn’t crawl out of some slimy pit or evolve from a distant ape. If we decended from the apes, how come there’s still apes? You’d think they’d be all gone by now.

    Second. There was Adam and Eve in the garden, not Adam and Steve. Think about this for one minute. If it was Adam and Steve, how in God’s beautiful earth did you get here? It takes two! God made it that way because Adam and Eve were suppose go and procreate the world.

    Third: If God said it, you better believe it. Why you ask. Because whether you believe in God or not, there’ll come a day when you’re going to meet His face to face. If I was a betting person, I think I would bet on believing what He says is true.

    I think Ray needs to re-think his life.

     
  29. Rachel

    September 18, 2008 at 7:57 pm

    Does God still love Ray Bolyz because he has come out of the closet? Of course he does! Doesnt it say in the bible that we have all sinned and fallen short of the glory og God? It also says that we shall not judge. I do not judge Ray Boltz because I myself have done alot of things that i knew was wrong but guess what i did anyways, and later came to regret and seek Gods forgiveness! But…. I must say this,as a great christain leader and a example for all christains, he has put a damper on his testimony and i fully believe in all my heart that it will be something that he will come to regret one day if not in this lifetime than the afterlife. God has instilled in us the ability to know right from wrong, and as a christain he knows that that lifestyle is wrong or it wouldnt have taken him all of his life to come out of the closet. If i could talk to Ray Boltz i would say something like this.. We love you as all christains are supposed to do but i dont agree with your lifestyle, it defies the christain example that God provided for us, please repent and come back to God!

     
  30. barrydean

    September 18, 2008 at 8:02 pm

    Wow. I wondered when someone was going to bring up the patented “log in the eye” verse to argue against confronting someone in love for their sinful life. I am a sinner too saved from an eternity of hell by the grace of God. If I were to engage in a lifestyle of sin I would hope that those who love me would confront me and discipline me in love as well. For I believe it is in love that repentance and restoration occurs. Not by telling someone that they agree, condone, or are passive toward the sinful brother.

    Jacob,

    You hit the nail mark on the head. Thanks for your input.

     
  31. Jacob Allee

    September 18, 2008 at 8:43 pm

    lol…very punny Barry. (For those who don’t know http://www.nailmark.org)

     
  32. barrydean

    September 18, 2008 at 11:59 pm

    Alright everyone. I thank you all for the comments and dialog. I should have known that this would be a very controversial topic. I think we are at an impasse here. Some think that the word of God is either outdated, can’t be interpreted, or no longer relevant. And there are others who say that scripture is sufficient and we should live our lives accordingly. This is the same old battle that has been going on since post-modernism took it’s hold. I have shut down the comments for this post. Stay tuned for more.

     
 
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